pilottangocharlie
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What kind of limitations would there be in using the Skyview panel to control the "advanced" autopilot?
Advanced Autopilot
- Thread starter djones
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What kind of limitations would there be in using the Skyview panel to control the "advanced" autopilot?
swatson999
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I saw it...and you said:
"There may be some limitations to the SkyView display interface..."
There shouldn't be ANY limitations on *capability*. I understand that the man-machine interface is different, so accessing the functionality may be different, but I'm not reassured when you say
"the advanced autopilot won’t be crippled without the control panel."
I don't want to lose ANY functionality if I don't use a control panel. I bought SV based on the scheme that ALL access to functions would be through the EFIS screen.
Reassure me that this is your plan, please
mmarien
Murray M.
A couple of years ago I planned for months, drafted multiple alternate panels including a G3X version, laid it out for the local FBO and took critical abuse and the odd cocked eyebrow from the old timers before I installed Skyview, but I planned for change. My breaker panel that cost a fortune to manufacture looks like a fancy vent with all the empty holes since VP-X. It's a good reminder that something better will always require change.
I'd like to have to rip out something dear to me in order to install a touch screen input panel - hint hint. In the mean time I'll contend myself with musing over where to place the advance autopilot panel and at the same time improve the aesthetics of my panel and add function - bonus eh?
If you want stability install a six pack. Good for a few years yet and nobody will ask what it is.
I'd like to have to rip out something dear to me in order to install a touch screen input panel - hint hint. In the mean time I'll contend myself with musing over where to place the advance autopilot panel and at the same time improve the aesthetics of my panel and add function - bonus eh?
If you want stability install a six pack. Good for a few years yet and nobody will ask what it is.
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So here is a suggestion for the powers that be at Dynon in regards to the verticle and horizontal question I posed. How about just making the unit with replaceable bezels so the installer can have what ever he or she may need??
Just an idea for you guys to consider.
Just an idea for you guys to consider.
swatson999
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NOT a bonus...plane isn't even in the air yet, the SV system is about 1 year old, and they're now talking about breaking the paradigm they established and around which many of us have designed our panels.
Had they said in their marketing brochures from day one that "future advanced autopilot features are planned, including a separate control panel", then we could have planned for that. As it is, it will either be kludgy, awkward or expensive/time-consuming for me if I have to add this device *which their design paradigm did not include* up until now.
Had they said in their marketing brochures from day one that "future advanced autopilot features are planned, including a separate control panel", then we could have planned for that. As it is, it will either be kludgy, awkward or expensive/time-consuming for me if I have to add this device *which their design paradigm did not include* up until now.
''Some common feedback that your likely to hear is that for early to ??? adopters of the Skyview, they are not gonna be happy ''
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You can be certain that I won't be happy either if I have to find room for an extra box (Room that I don't have, I fly an RV-4 after all ) or that I will loose functionability if it goes through the Skyview...
Geez sometime I think that I'm still dealing with Blue Mountain...
Dynon, put the function in the Skyview and let us deal with the buttons twisting in IFR..
Thank you
Bruno
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You can be certain that I won't be happy either if I have to find room for an extra box (Room that I don't have, I fly an RV-4 after all ) or that I will loose functionability if it goes through the Skyview...
Geez sometime I think that I'm still dealing with Blue Mountain...
Dynon, put the function in the Skyview and let us deal with the buttons twisting in IFR..
Thank you
Bruno
rfinch
New Member
Bump. Request repeated.
trevpond
New Member
I'm with Bruno (RV4) who's views echo my own.
I don't have one inch of panel space left in my Europa; it was always my understanding that the Skyview was a standalone unit and needed no further switchgear.
From my perspective, it has to be able to control all it's functions with the knobs and switches available to it and if it can't, then it is not the unit I originally bought.For goodness sake Dynon, keep all functions within the box and switchgear in the unit. It may be more difficult for you to do, but the "kiss" principle reigns!
regards
Trev
I don't have one inch of panel space left in my Europa; it was always my understanding that the Skyview was a standalone unit and needed no further switchgear.
From my perspective, it has to be able to control all it's functions with the knobs and switches available to it and if it can't, then it is not the unit I originally bought.
For goodness sake Dynon, keep all functions within the box and switchgear in the unit. It may be more difficult for you to do, but the "kiss" principle reigns!regards
Trev
trevpond
New Member
I'm with Bruno (RV4) who's views echo my own.
I don't have one inch of panel space left in my Europa; it was always my understanding that the Skyview was a standalone unit and needed no further switchgear.
From my perspective, it has to be able to control all it's functions with the knobs and switches available to it and if it can't, then it is not the unit I originally bought.For goodness sake Dynon, keep all functions within the box and switchgear in the unit. It may be more difficult for you to do, but the "kiss" principle reigns!
regards
Trev
I don't have one inch of panel space left in my Europa; it was always my understanding that the Skyview was a standalone unit and needed no further switchgear.
From my perspective, it has to be able to control all it's functions with the knobs and switches available to it and if it can't, then it is not the unit I originally bought.
For goodness sake Dynon, keep all functions within the box and switchgear in the unit. It may be more difficult for you to do, but the "kiss" principle reigns!regards
Trev
I agree completely except you need a knob for altitude too. All you need to be convinced is -- while on Auto-pilot -- twist the joystick for the heading bug when it's set on Baro. Or twist for heading when set for altitude. Or, just overshoot a twist in rough air. All very easy to do and not easy to correct. A dedicated box with those two modes at least and knobs with twist resistance equivalent to the HS-34 is a must for IFR -- as an option for sure -- IMHO.
Jack L
RV8MW
New Member
My panel is cut painted and installed but I am willing to cut another hole. I really think it would be more user friendly. But I can go either way.
dabear
New Member
So I fly with 2 10" panels in the front pit of my plane. That gives me a dedicated knob for map and for Baro. The other two are used for heading and altitude. It would be hard if I only had one screen.
I understand those that want to use the SV screen and can agree that the functionality should be there, but understand it means multiple knob/button pushes.
I'd like to see a dedicated module with 2-3 knobs:
1. Course/Heading
2. Altitude
3. Baro Pressure
Buttons for:
Hdg
Trk
Nav
Alt
Vert Speed
Vert Nav
Hold
The system so far works GREAT. I'd like to see the ability to select/build a vertical flight plan that allows you to set altitudes over points and have the plane climb/descend to those points as appropriate.
Also a Flight Director would be great as well. Don't know if y'all have plans for that.
The ability to fly a hold would also be fantastic. Set time/distance legs, point, and direction would make it easy.
Asking a lot, and I'm sure Dynon will not deliver it all tomorrow. But y'all keep meeting and exceeding expectations.
Bear
I understand those that want to use the SV screen and can agree that the functionality should be there, but understand it means multiple knob/button pushes.
I'd like to see a dedicated module with 2-3 knobs:
1. Course/Heading
2. Altitude
3. Baro Pressure
Buttons for:
Hdg
Trk
Nav
Alt
Vert Speed
Vert Nav
Hold
The system so far works GREAT. I'd like to see the ability to select/build a vertical flight plan that allows you to set altitudes over points and have the plane climb/descend to those points as appropriate.
Also a Flight Director would be great as well. Don't know if y'all have plans for that.
The ability to fly a hold would also be fantastic. Set time/distance legs, point, and direction would make it easy.
Asking a lot, and I'm sure Dynon will not deliver it all tomorrow. But y'all keep meeting and exceeding expectations.
Bear
- Joined
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It will not require a certified GPS, but it won't fly a GPS approach without one. The advanced autopilot isn't an update to our map software that allows it to do full GPS approaches on it's own (which would not be allowed in most countries anyway).
The advanced AP is no different than the current AP in this sense. It will follow whatever external guidance you give it. So if your GPS outputs vertical guidance, we can follow that (yes, including handheld units and possibly a SkyView-based vertical planning feature). For sure, without a Certified GPS on board or a glideslope receiver, the advanced AP won't add a lot of features to the system, but there will still be some neat stuff.
Alas, thread is diverging a bit here...
I too vote for this. I have a single screen with MAP always in view, meaning right knob is dedicated to the MAP range. Thus, everything else is overloaded on a single knob. Thus, I am constantly toggling the function on that knob by left-toggle then toggle-down or up thru the list of functions.
One alternative would be left-toggle then each of the functions is shown over a button. I can then hit a single button instead of having to scroll thru a list.
Finally, another quirk is when the autopilot is on in TRK mode, why do I lose the ability to change the heading bug? I often use TRK mode but wish I could still retain the use of the HDG bug for misc vectors or wind heading when I get ATIS for landing.
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It's all about tradeoffs. KISS from the standpoint of keeping all of the controls on the display is a bit opposed to the increased simplicity of the actual button-pushing once you remote it and add dedicated controls. Anyway, our goal is to do as much as possible via the SkyView display itself, and we're still trying to work through what that looks like.
If I get a vote, and it sounds like I do, I would vote to have a horizontal option.
In another string there was a comment that the Dynon radio head would be the size and shape of a business card. I would vote for a horizontal orientation version of the radio head too.
In my ideal world the two heads (radio and A/P) would be the same size and would be designed so that they could mount side by side in the width of a standard radio rack (think SL30 width).
As I understand it (and obviously I am working with limited information), I would think both devices need a display (frequency or heading maybe), a knob (change frequency / heading) and maybe some buttons and/or lights. We are talking about a control head/display, not really the smarts of either device. Would it be possible to design a single unit that could be configured (maybe even on the fly, so to speak) to do either function?
Phil
In another string there was a comment that the Dynon radio head would be the size and shape of a business card. I would vote for a horizontal orientation version of the radio head too.
In my ideal world the two heads (radio and A/P) would be the same size and would be designed so that they could mount side by side in the width of a standard radio rack (think SL30 width).
As I understand it (and obviously I am working with limited information), I would think both devices need a display (frequency or heading maybe), a knob (change frequency / heading) and maybe some buttons and/or lights. We are talking about a control head/display, not really the smarts of either device. Would it be possible to design a single unit that could be configured (maybe even on the fly, so to speak
) to do either function? Phil
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Sorry, precise dimensions aren't yet available. The front face (not the cutout, though) will be roughly the size of a business card; two of them stacked vertically on top of each other would exactly match the height of a 10" SkyView display (as you may have seen on one of our demo panels at the shows, which has a blank strip for this purpose).
If we are talking REALLY advanced autopilot, would it be possible to get some sort of device/servo that can control the throttle? This might be in version N +1 or +2.
I would love to see something where you program climb at X RPM, cruise at Y RPM, and descend, at or about, Z RPM. I say at or about to allow the aircraft to stay on a glideslope, regardless of wind. This could be used in a vertical profile of a flight plan.
I love the idea that, if I go unconscious, my copilot, with virtually no training, could simply manage the A/P setting on the Dynon and get down softly, only needing to flare.
Who knows. Someday if your GPS reading is really accurate in 3 dimensions, and the Dynon knows the real GPS altitude of the runway at each point of the length of the runway, maybe the Dynon could know when and how to flare. This is probably pretty far out there. Ah well, we can dream.
Phil
I would love to see something where you program climb at X RPM, cruise at Y RPM, and descend, at or about, Z RPM. I say at or about to allow the aircraft to stay on a glideslope, regardless of wind. This could be used in a vertical profile of a flight plan.
I love the idea that, if I go unconscious, my copilot, with virtually no training, could simply manage the A/P setting on the Dynon and get down softly, only needing to flare.
Who knows. Someday if your GPS reading is really accurate in 3 dimensions, and the Dynon knows the real GPS altitude of the runway at each point of the length of the runway, maybe the Dynon could know when and how to flare. This is probably pretty far out there. Ah well, we can dream.
Phil