Dynon NAV/COMM???

[Carl_Froehlich]

I’ve poked the good folks at Dynon about offering a TSO GPS navigator for years - and have got a consistent “we are not working on this” (but I still have hope).

But shoot fire - how about a Dynon NAV/COMM? Think about taking the current Dynon radio and adding nav capability. The immediate gain (at least for me) is I would not have to buy another grossly overpriced GTN-650 for the new RV project, instead buying the overpriced GNC-355 GPS/Comm Instead.

End result, a TSO GPS navigator, two comms and a nav/loc/GS receiver.

What say you Dynon?

Carl Froehlich

 

[GalinHdz]

A Dynon NAV/COMM actually makes a lot of sense, especially if it can interface to the SkyView display via the Dynon network connection. Having the ability to do VOR/ILS/LOC approaches within a Comm radio is something even some handheld radios can do.

 

[kellym]

I’ve poked the good folks at Dynon about offering a TSO GPS navigator for years - and have got a consistent “we are not working on this” (but I still have hope).

But shoot fire - how about a Dynon NAV/COMM? Think about taking the current Dynon radio and adding nav capability. The immediate gain (at least for me) is I would not have to buy another grossly overpriced GTN-650 for the new RV project, instead buying the overpriced GNC-355 GPS/Comm Instead.

End result, a TSO GPS navigator, two comms and a nav/loc/GS receiver.

What say you Dynon?

Carl Froehlich

How about a used SL-30 or a Garmin 225? Or really old, a used KX-155. I have SL-30 and GTN-650 for my IFR navigation.

 

[jnmeade]

What other equipment would be needed to implement a NAV/COMM? TSO'd head? Upgraded audio panel?

 

[kellym]

What other equipment would be needed to implement a NAV/COMM? TSO'd head? Upgraded audio panel?

Your Dynon provides a perfectly adequate and legal display of the nav signal. However, you may want a separate display for redundancy reasons.
AFAIK there has never been a requirement for a NavCom or its display to have TSO certification, unless the aircraft was flown Part 135 or similar for hire. Many 1970 and newer aircraft came with KX170B as primary navcom, and were perfectly legal for IFR. The 170B never had TSO certification...you had to upgrade to the KX175 for that, even though the units were virtually identical. Later, Narco and King opted to certify their Mark12D and KX155 respectively, probably to avoid the expense of having two separate product lines. I don't recall about Loran requirements, but AFAIK only GPS nav units must be TSO certified.

 

[Carl_Froehlich]

How about a used SL-30 or a Garmin 225? Or really old, a used KX-155. I have SL-30 and GTN-650 for my IFR navigation.

The SL-30 was, in my opinion, the best value in a NAV/Comm - too bad Garmin killed it to replace with their inferior NAV/Comm. So the SL-30 is great - until it needs repair. Then it is only good for parts.

An integrated Dynon NAV/Comm playing with the SkyView is a perfect way for Dynon to continue to evolve, offering a needed capability with little risk.

Carl

 

[jakej]

I hear you Carl, my ‘Apollo’ (UPS AT) ‘stack’ was the first flying here, excellent equipment & I still have my SL30 & MX20. The rest I sold earlier & the GX60 was last to go ( display/chipset manufacturer stopped supplying them for whatever reason) . IMO the big G bought the Apollo line to kill opposition & for the technology that was in the GNS480 to apply it to the 430/530 series - it still took them years for that to happen & now they don’t support the 480 anymore. Support cutoff has applied to many of their models It seems to be a common theme with many people being caught out & having to spend big dollars for replacements. So then the ‘anti’ G movement gains momentum.
Now everything else I have, except for my audio panel, is Dynon. Why - they have excellent support, 3 years warranty & excellent after warranty repair rates & terms, their “legacy” eg D10/D100 series design enabled a partial update to the SV units without replacing everything. Autopilot servos stayed the same & just needed an extra twisted pair wires & the engine sensor harness just plugged into the SV module with minor changes.
Then if one decided to change to the latest HDX units it is truly a “plug & Play” process (just have to easily add 2 x nutplates to the panel for each screen) what’s not to love about that!
My background ? I’ve worked in the avionics industry for 5 1/2 + years working with various manufacturers including Ps-Engineering, UPSAT (Apollo), Garmin, Honeywell, Bendix King, Narco & several others. Since then I still buy PS eng products as they’re the best GA audio IMO ( I’m not a Dealer as I don’t have a Licenced ‘shop) but now not any of the others. Now I have Dynon & Avidyne (excellent combination) with a couple of other items - don’t want to give up my ’dumb’ MX20 ( needs GPS to drive it) though as it’s a big screen, cost me a lot & I didn’t need to remove it to make room for anything so just kept it.
Dynon ‘rocks’ ! and I don’t see the need to go elsewhere for most system upgrade/changes, others opinions may vary.

 

[Carl_Froehlich]

Still looking for a comment from Dynon.

Carl

 

[jakej]

Carl, I hear you however you know Dynon, & most smart businesses, don't 'announce' anything until it really is at least close to being on the market. Too many 'red faces' & vapour ware situations in the past for them to fall into that trap.
In our country NDB's have almost disappeared & the VOR's are few & far apart, some of are questioning whether a NAV receiver combined with Gps & Com is worth buying now. IMO the better option for Dynon would be offering a standalone Gps or Gps/Com IF they wanted the expense & risk of going down that track. Would it not be better for them to concentrate on the existing Dynon products & maybe buy other 'rebadged' items (they do already with the COM & Transponder = Trig) off the shelf ? Others like UPSAT, Bendix King & Avidyne (talking audio panels here) have done that & just focussed on their 'core' products.

 

[Carl_Froehlich]

Yep - my exact thought. Rebrand the Trig NAV/Comm as is (with software update to be compatible with the SkyView). Or to be more eloquent repackage the Trig NAV/COMM for remote mount, modifiy the existing Dynon Comm module to do dual COMM/NAV frequency selections, and do the needed software modifications.

VORs will go away someday but for now actual IMC approaches into class B or C still seem to prefer ILS.

 

[kellym]

Yep - my exact thought. Rebrand the Trig NAV/Comm as is (with software update to be compatible with the SkyView). Or to be more eloquent repackage the Trig NAV/COMM for remote mount, modifiy the existing Dynon Comm module to do dual COMM/NAV frequency selections, and do the needed software modifications.

VORs will go away someday but for now actual IMC approaches into class B or C still seem to prefer ILS.

I agree that there is a need for VHF navigation. It is also half the cost of a certified GPS receiver, doesn't need any data updates, and works when the military is jamming GPS for whatever reason. A Dynon NavCom would enable VHF IFR without needing to add much. Solid backup for and GPS equipment. Given there are legal portable navcoms for under $500, it should be possible to build/acquire a private label nav receiver to integrate into their com.

 

[jnmeade]

"Given there are legal portable navcoms for under $500, it should be possible to build/acquire a private label nav receiver to integrate into their com."
I guess I'm behind and was unaware of portable legal navcoms. Could you mention one if you have a chance? Thanks.

 

[Dynon]

Carl, I hear you however you know Dynon, & most smart businesses, don't 'announce' anything until it really is at least close to being on the market. Too many 'red faces' & vapour ware situations in the past for them to fall into that trap.

. Just ask some of our long time customers about the AP76 <shudders>.We generally keep projects quiet until announcement time. We've come really close before and have had to not release for various reasons.

 

[CanardMulti]

Time to post instead of lurking. I'd buy a network integrated Dynon Nav/Com in a heartbeat. I could then ditch the stand alone Nav that's emulating the nav side of an SL30 and monopolizing my last remaining SV RS232 port after the other four had to be dedicated to SV-GPS-2020, backup SV-GPS-250, SV-ADSB-472, and SV-XPNDR-261. Anyone else want to see a network connected expansion module that adds more RS 232 ports?

 

[Raymo]

Anyone else want to see a network connected expansion module that adds more RS 232 ports?

Or the ability to use one or more USB ports (Universal Serial Bus) for input/output.

 

[kellym]

"Given there are legal portable navcoms for under $500, it should be possible to build/acquire a private label nav receiver to integrate into their com."
I guess I'm behind and was unaware of portable legal navcoms. Could you mention one if you have a chance? Thanks.

Real old one I still use: King KX-99. Sporty's, Icom, and others all have them.

 

[skysailor]

Would love to see a serial port expander for the Dynon. Grand Rapids has this for their systems. Use one serial port to add three more.

 

[RV14_TD]

How about adding native support for MGL N16 radio? The N16 hardware looks fine, the price is reasonable.
Software integration with SV is in my opinion a problem, as the integration relies on a protocol that both Dynon and MGL reverse engineered
As I understand MGL open sourced "API" for their radios and therefore Dynon could support them natively.

 

[GalinHdz]

I guess I'm behind and was unaware of portable legal navcoms. Could you mention one if you have a chance? Thanks.

As stated "there has never been a requirement for a NavCom or its display to have TSO certification, unless the aircraft was flown Part 135 or similar for hire."

Just look at the 60's and 70's Cessnas, Pipers and other certificated airplanes with original avionics. None are TSO'd.

 

[CanardMulti]

The nav radio monopolizing my sole remaining serial port (after the 4 required by serial only SV-XXX inputs) is an MGL N16, talking to SV via emulation of an SL30. It works, but still has "issues". I have no doubt it would perform fine if talking to an MGL EFIS, but the emulation aspect has required multiple work arounds for the radio to be usable for an ILS on the main SV PFD HSI. Also, the secondary frequency on the MGL Vega OBS & tuning head will not display on SV PFD when the N16 standby nav frequency is selected for the SV #2 bearing pointer. I believe the N16 also does have the ability to access data base stored nav frequencies in other mfg. installations, but the emulation again does not work well enough to access the nav frequencies that do exist in the Seattle Avionics supplied SV data base. All are software / firmware issues that no doubt would be straight forward to address in either an N16 addition to nav radio sources in setup or a re-badging situation. My sense is I'd best not hold my breath, though.

How about adding native support for MGL N16 radio? The N16 hardware looks fine, the price is reasonable.
Software integration with SV is in my opinion a problem, as the integration relies on a protocol that both Dynon and MGL reverse engineered
As I understand MGL open sourced "API" for their radios and therefore Dynon could support them natively.