rvator51
Member
If obstruction is in path of AP, have AP either climb higher automatically to avoid obstruction or divert around it then rejoin origin path/course.
Have Autopilot detour around obstructions
- Thread starter rvator51
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KRviator
Guest
Quasi-TFR in a SkyView system? What on earth for? And who on earth (or above it) has AP engaged when there are obstacles that require an avoidance manoeuvre?
rvator51
Member
Just about every short flight or long flight I do involves obstructions that are higher than my flight. One of the pleasures of living in the West USA. I suspect in the next 10 to 20 years or less, most APs will have intelligent routing as a basic feature.
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You really aren't asking for the autopilot to do this, you are asking for the map to do so.
Autopilots follow external commands. Go left, go right, go up, go down. You don't tell the autopilot to take you from KDVT to KCGZ, you tell the map to, and then you tell the AP to follow the map's output.
So, this is a feature you are asking for in the map. The upside to this is that it would show you terrain conflicts even if you didn't have an autopilot in the plane at all and were just hand flying a flight plan.
The downside is that this is exceedingly complex. The system can't assume that it can climb at any point since it has no authority over the throttle, and even if it did, it would need to know the climb performance of the aircraft at your current mixture. So, all it can really do for sure is turn at your current altitude.
How far before the terrain does it turn?
Does it take you all the way up a box canyon before deciding to turn around at the last possible moment, or does it just refuse to enter even if you are currently climbing, but might not make it if the user backs off the throttle?
When you plan a flight on the ground, how does it know what altitudes you will be at as you are at various points along your flight? Because it needs to scream at you before you depart that your route is going to be 2,700 NM long at your altitude, not the 120NM you think it will be.
Does it need to avoid airspace for you as it takes you somewhere you didn't ask? What about weather?
How do you tell it the attitude is OK if the computer has an issue and is blocking you from going where you want?
What if your new route leaves you with zero fuel long before your final destination?
And probably a hundred other things. At some point, there is a reason the pilot is in the plane.
At the same time, with the pace of avionics, I can't disagree that in 20 years, pilots won't be needed. Dynon has only been selling products for 10 years and look where we are!
Autopilots follow external commands. Go left, go right, go up, go down. You don't tell the autopilot to take you from KDVT to KCGZ, you tell the map to, and then you tell the AP to follow the map's output.
So, this is a feature you are asking for in the map. The upside to this is that it would show you terrain conflicts even if you didn't have an autopilot in the plane at all and were just hand flying a flight plan.
The downside is that this is exceedingly complex. The system can't assume that it can climb at any point since it has no authority over the throttle, and even if it did, it would need to know the climb performance of the aircraft at your current mixture. So, all it can really do for sure is turn at your current altitude.
How far before the terrain does it turn?
Does it take you all the way up a box canyon before deciding to turn around at the last possible moment, or does it just refuse to enter even if you are currently climbing, but might not make it if the user backs off the throttle?
When you plan a flight on the ground, how does it know what altitudes you will be at as you are at various points along your flight? Because it needs to scream at you before you depart that your route is going to be 2,700 NM long at your altitude, not the 120NM you think it will be.
Does it need to avoid airspace for you as it takes you somewhere you didn't ask? What about weather?
How do you tell it the attitude is OK if the computer has an issue and is blocking you from going where you want?
What if your new route leaves you with zero fuel long before your final destination?
And probably a hundred other things. At some point, there is a reason the pilot is in the plane.
At the same time, with the pace of avionics, I can't disagree that in 20 years, pilots won't be needed. Dynon has only been selling products for 10 years and look where we are!
rvator51
Member
Its just a suggestion, I thought it was a good one, but I guess not. I will bring it up again in 10 years. 
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Didn't mean to completely shut you down, it's just a very complex thing to do. We'll put it on the list.
trevpond
New Member
Dynon
Does this mean that the a/p won't do the taxying for us either??!!
Trev
Does this mean that the a/p won't do the taxying for us either??!!
Trev
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Hmm, I'm starting to like this more and more. You'll need one servo for the mixture, one for the prop speed, one for the throttle, one for the rudder, and one for each brake. That's $4500 in servos. Maybe we should do this!
trevpond
New Member
Can't wait to see the code to drive them all!!
Trev ;D ;D
Trev ;D ;D
rvator51
Member
Dont forget the servo to prod and wake the pilot when the AP gets to its destination.
If by biscuits you mean dollars, it sounds like you're asking for a pay as you fly model. Swipe your credit card to keep using SkyView for the next 20 minutes. We'll consider it
Speaking of auto throttles, any thoughts or thoughts of thoughts on an auto throttle system. It seems that the SV has all the I/O to control a servo and "monkey motion" similar to the elevator servo only in the horizontal plane. Just daydreaming after reading about the new SV Touch. Besides, what else is left to automate? Dan
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Dynon actually started out in autopilots with drones. Ones that fly over the horizon, do their thing, and come back. So we do know a lot about autothrottles.
There are some real issues- on an Engine with prop and mixture controls, there's a lot more to making more power than just pushing the black knob in.
Then, autothrottles are worthless unless you tell the AP what you want to do. Do you want it to hold airspeed? Should it firewall the throttle (and burn a ton more fuel) every time there is a little downdraft that causes your airspeed to drop 5 knots? When you go to fly that approach, how do you tell it to fly the glideslope at 90 knots?
Anyway, all possible technically, and maybe we'll get there someday, but unless you are doing full autoland, or your plane is always up against Vne like a jet, autothrottles are of kind of limited use in a piston single.
There are some real issues- on an Engine with prop and mixture controls, there's a lot more to making more power than just pushing the black knob in.
Then, autothrottles are worthless unless you tell the AP what you want to do. Do you want it to hold airspeed? Should it firewall the throttle (and burn a ton more fuel) every time there is a little downdraft that causes your airspeed to drop 5 knots? When you go to fly that approach, how do you tell it to fly the glideslope at 90 knots?
Anyway, all possible technically, and maybe we'll get there someday, but unless you are doing full autoland, or your plane is always up against Vne like a jet, autothrottles are of kind of limited use in a piston single.
Re: Thoughts on thoughts. I think I understand the complexities and limited uses in various situations. I just thought it would be nice to dial in an airspeed number and have the aircraft hold that airspeed. Somewhat like engaging the autopilot once it is trimmed for straight and level. I expect on the drones you had altitude compensating carb for mixture control. Dan