Navworx

[benzh]

will the new Navworx ADSB out solution for experimentals interface with Skyview and Dynon's transponder?  Cost is $700, plus antennas.  The company told me it includes a GPS source in the device that complies.
http://www.navworx.com/products-ADS600-EXP.php

 

[dynonsupport]

As a brand new product announced only a day or so ago, we haven't had the opportunity to look into supporting it yet. As a remote UAT, it needs the EFIS to configure it and control it, so it would be a new feature for us.

It is an impressive price point that Navworx has hit, if it in fact complies. Once they publish their means of compliance, we'll be able to see if it's a good fit for SkyView.

 

[preid]

3 bits of good news I took from this:
1) weather to displays connected via internal WIFI and/or RS-232 serial channel- Didn't we see a Wi-Fi option in v12 that no one is talking about yet at Dynon?
2)Displays ADS-B Traffic & Weather (FIS-B) on non-proprietary systems such as Advanced Flight Displays (AFS), - Hmm isn't AFS, Dynon now- shouldn't be hard to make it work on a Dynon based on that interface.. should it?
3)" if it in fact complies"- Meets performance requirements of TSO-C154c

Seriously, please do look into this option since most of us are "experimental".
Its exciting to see the price point come down so much, may lead others to follow suit.

 

[dynonsupport]

The issue is the GPS. C154C is the TSO for the transmitter, which isn't that hard to meet. We need to see if the internal GPS really has a demonstrated method of complying with the FAR, which requires a Source Integrity Level of 3, which basically requires compliance with a multi-hundred page TSO and DO-178 software and no statement has yet been made that it complies with any of that.

We really are hoping Navworx has collapsed the cost of ADS-B, as we all want to see it be affordable. For right now nobody is sure if that has actually been achieved.

 

[bdalporto]

I copied this from the Navworx web site;

"The ADS600-EXP is a Remote Mount ADS-B Transceiver with UAT OUT & IN, for use by EXPERIMENTAL AND LSA AIRCRAFT ONLY - Not for use by Certified Aircraft..

Experimental and LSA aircraft equipping with the ADS600-EXP are "good-to-go" for entering airspace mandated to have ADS-B on 1/1/2020.

Complies with the ADS-B Final Rule Technical Amendment, dated 2/9/2015, affecting 14 CFR 91.225 (b)(1)(ii) which permits ADS-B OUT in the National Airspace with devices that meet the performance requirements of TSO-C154c.

Transmits SDA = 2, SIL= 3"

I think "SIL=3" means they are claiming Source Integrity Level 3

 

[dynonsupport]

While we really hope the device is fully compliant with everything you need for 2020, we have some good reasons to be skeptical until we have more data. We'll need that data before we put Dynon's implicit approval on the device by supporting it. Plus, it's not like we can support a device or even promise support for it before it's shipped or has any data published about it.

Remember, you're the one that has to comply with the FAR, not the company that sold you something, so you want to be really sure. That's what a TSO actually gives a certified plane- the data that you know it complies, not just that you need to trust the vendor that it does.

 

[rvator51]

While we really hope the device is fully compliant with everything you need for 2020, we have some good reasons to be skeptical until we have more data. We'll need that data before we put Dynon's implicit approval on the device by supporting it. Plus, it's not like we can support a device or even promise support for it before it's shipped or has any data published about it.

I am not sure I quite understand this. For the ADS-B out side of the device, what does Dynon have to support? Its a separate system that doesnt tie into Skyview? For the ADS-B in side, its not mandated so what is the risk? Also, on the ADS-B in, the Navworx website says its already supported by Wing X and others and also Advanced Flight Systems, which is a Dynon company. I assume that means that they are using the same published protocol for the new box as they used for their previous boxes. So you should have access already to their protocol?

 

[mmarien]

Navworx website says its already supported by Wing X and others

Not really. It states:

Remote Mount UAT Transceiver for Experimental & LSA aircraft.

The ADS600-EXP offers full ADS-B OUT (transmit), and IN (receive) capabiliteis, deliverying traffic and weather to displays connected via internal WIFI and/or RS-232 serial channel.

Sends Traffic & Weather to popular iPad apps like Hilton WingX, Adventure Pilot iFly-GPS, and Seattle Avionics FlyQ. 

Displays ADS-B Traffic & Weather (FIS-B) on non-proprietary systems such as Advanced Flight Displays (AFS), and Grand Rapid Technologies (GRT) EFIS's.

It seems weather and traffic are easy to get as there are a number of devices out there that do that. What's interesting is their claim:

The ADS600-EXP meets the ADS-B Final Rule Technical Amendment, dated 2/9/2015, affecting 14 CFR 91.225 (b)(1)(ii) which permits ADS-B OUT in the NAS with devices that meet the performance requirements of TSO-C154c

A reasonably priced GPS is the part that has been missing to this point. Of course if it works like their spell checker it may need more work.

 

[preid]

Any update on Dynon R&D with Navworx EXP? in other words any closer to being able to use a Navworx ADS-B displayed on Skyview?

 

[dynonsupport]

No updates.

 

[preid]

thanks for the update ;D

 

[lolachampcar]

Looks like NW has hit an $800 price point. Given the even greater number of possible iterations with the installation of their product, I'm having a hard time believing they have an answer to the problem of insuring good installed system performance. The counter to that is that they are shipping a certified version of the product which the FAA has (obviously) accepted. Have they taken the path of simply producing a non-certified version of the exact same piece of equipment?

AeroLeds does as does Clarity Aloft and others but the price difference between certified and experimental is not $3000/$800. Does anyone have any insight into exactly what they are doing? Dynon, can you comment here or otherwise provide useful input?

 

[dynonsupport]

The position source (GPS) in the Navworx is not the same as in their STC'd versions. The data sheet makes that clear. So it's not the same device in a very meaningful way.

The FAA is in the middle of clarifying the install and regulatory environment for ADS-B in experimental planes. Dynon is going to wait for that guidance before we offer much of an opinion.

 

[preid]

Navworx status?

Looks like Navworx-ADS600-EXP is up to $1049 now. Is there any update on the ability to see a Navworx ADS-B on the screen?
Is it simply a matter of plugging it into a RS232 connection and it will be displayed or is there a specific requirement we need to wait on?
Thank you!

 

[dynonsupport]

We do not currently support the Navworx device. It is not yet shipping and we are waiting to see if it is actually a compliant device. The FAA is working on guidance for experimental vendors to define what parts of the TSO need to be meet to meet the requirements in 91.225.