Third party IFR Navigators and Skyview Configuration Settings

[cbretana]

I just installed the Garmin GPS 175 in my panel. I have a Skyview HDX with Dynon Autopilot. Can someone please direct me to where in the users manual or the installation manual I can find the various configuration settings (other than the ARINC-429 settings), necessary to use the flight plans and couple the Dynon A/P to GPS approaches from the GPS 175?

On page 5-47 of the users manual, the 3rd paragraph in the Flight Planning section mentions knowing whether Skyview has been configured to "always tie flight plans to the HSI navigation source", but it does not say where in the setup menu ( or anywhere else), you need to go to set this configuration option and to read/ understand what it does. I did find it, (I think), on pg 12-10 of the Install manual,

Go to SETUP MENU > MAP SETUP and select TIE FLIGHT PLAN SRC TO HSI NAV SRC to select whether you want the flight plan source to be independent from the HSI navigation source.

But I am not sure exactly what this means. If set to YES, does this mean that any time to change the data source to either of these, that the data source to the other will automatically change to remain in synch? If so, what happens if you switch HSI source to point to a VOR/ ILS, ADF, or any other source that is not also a flight plan? Does the flight plan source stay as is?

Reading between the lines I gather that at one point, the software was set up so that you could change the flight plan waypoints in the GPS 175 or in the Skyview and the change would be propagated to the other system, but that Garmin has disabled this capapability.

What about the SHOW [DATA SRC] ON MAP setting? Can anyone tell me where to find that setting? Is it only visible when a third party [external] navigation data source is selected?

There is also an ALLOW AUTO SWITCH setting, which I found in the Install manual. As I read this, this allows the GPS 175 to send a signal to Skyview to automatically switch the HSI nav source to the ILS at the appropriate time on the approach. Is that correct?

 

[swatson999]

Essentially, yes, that's what it means. Setting this option to Yes means that whatever you choose for the HSI input (via the HSI SRC button on the PFD menu) drives the flight plan. If you pick an external navigator as the source, like a 430W or whatever, and you have an active flight plan in the navigator, then the HSI *and* the displayed flight plan display that data. If you select SKYVIEW as the source, then the HSI and the magenta line both display *that* data.

What you *can* do, and I wouldn't, is to untie the sources by setting the option to NO. That means the magenta line on the map can be completely unrelated to the HSI. E.g., you have an active flight plan that you set up and activate using the flight planning subsystem on Skyview, AND you have a completely different flight plan active in an external navigator (say, by a Direct-to function or even a full flight plan). You can have the *map* show one, and the HSI show the *other*, and they're completely unrelated, and it is VERY VERY confusing, at least IMO. I have no idea why anyone would do this, but hey, what do I know?

This is not about "propagating" a flight plan from SV to anything else. This is about what is displayed. In fact, to my knowledge, there is no way to cross-fill a flight plan from SV's flight planning subsystem to an external device, nor vice-versa (if you've got one, and configured everything correctly, you will see the active flight plan in your external navigator as a tab on the flight planning menu pop-up...see the section on flight planning for an example...that's simply *displaying* the data from the navigator, NOT copying it over to SV's flight planning system).

Lastly, do you mean

Displaying Flight Plans from External Navigation Devices on the Map
When a compatible external GPS navigator is installed, press MAP > FPL to open the Flight Plan window and menu. The currently active Flight Plan is displayed. Move the joystick left or right to display any available flight plan sources in the window. The flight plan currently being displayed on the Map is designated with two arrows that point at the name: >SKYVIEW< or >IFR GPS<. To display the flight plan on SkyView’s moving map press the FPL MENU button, and select “SHOW [GPS NAME] FPL ON MAP” (where [GPS NAME] is the display name you’ve assigned your external navigator).

ETA: BTW, there's no rule that says you can't go up on a nice clear day, maybe take along a buddy, and try out all these different settings in the air and see what they do. All the words on a page can be far less helpful in learning a system than just taking it out for a spin and seeing what happens when you change the options around.

 

[cbretana]

Yes, I'm about to go do that, - Weather permitting, probably tomorrow.

 

[Rhino]

What buddy? He can barely fit his legs into that cockpit.

 

[cbretana]

Easy to get them in, getting them out is the problem.

 

[cbretana]

Found the TIE FLIGHT PLAN TO HSI SRC setting. It was set to No. Set it to YES, and everything now works as I expected.

 

[frogman208]

So here is the problem, you should be able to set it to NO and untie the flight plan from the CDI source. Problem is that won’t work for me either. I have a dual Dynon HDX with Garmin 355 and Trig 56X. I’ve wanted to fly the Garmin 355 flight plan (being displayed on HDX) while using the Trig 56 CDI capability. Conclusion is this does not work, I’m able to see the flight plan under the flight button but when I select the Garmin as the source for the flight plan it won’t show up on the map. I’ve made a video and will show it here once it uploads. If I tie the flight plan source and CDI source together as explained above, it displayed the Garmin 355 flight plan but if I change SRC (source) it obviously changes the display and since the Trig does not have its own display it defaults to the dynon map. Seems like we have more work in hand to do. Here is my setup.

 

[frogman208]

Just read Swatson999 above, maybe I can’t just use the touch feature, I have to use the FPL menu button then scroll down to show flt plan on map. Wish this could be just done with a touch but apparently not. I need this feature to switch from flt plan in the Garmin 355 but shooting a green needle approach so for me this is great. Usually I get to the Vectors to final and switch source which takes the map away but I’m on green needles already on the approach so it doesn’t matter till I go missed. Will be great to be able to keep the 355 flight plan up while I do run green needles. For those that don’t know, the 355 has VOR, LOC and ILS approaches in it, can’t legally shoot with it but the mapping to each of the way points while I’m on green needles would be awesome.

 

[cbretana]

If I understand your issue, you are talking about shooting an ILS approach on the Trig 56 X at the destination airport which is the last waypoint on a flight plan from the Garmin GNC 355, right? If not, exactly what scenario are you interested in? Remember, you can change the Nav Source for one of the two bearing pointers to point at the Trig 56X if you are flying a Garmin 355 sourced Flight plan and just want to monitor a Vor...

But if the Switch to ILS on an approach issue is the scenario you are trying to affect, then you really only need to see the Garmin 355 flight plan up until the Trig 56X picks up the Localizer signal, and after that you no longer need the flight plan displayed, you really should have the Trig 56X localizer ground track displayed. So, there is another setting in the Dynon Skyview that causes it to automatically switch nav source from the 355 to the Trig 56X. It is ALLOW AUTO SWITCH, in the ARCINC-429 configuration screen in System setup, I think.

Go to Dynon web site and download the
Third Party Device Connection and Configuration Reference Guide.

In Para 2.3, Skyview Configuration Settings, it says:
To allow SkyView to automatically change displayed data between INPUT1 and INPUT2, select ALLOW AUTO SWITCH: YES (LABEL 100P). If set to YES (LABEL 100P):

• •
  If the source transmits the "100P" label (such as Garmin GNS/GTN series), SkyView will automatically switch inputs per the label. This allows the inputs to be remotely switched by data from the source, either when the CDI is changed, or automatic transition on approach.
• •
  If data is being transmitted to INPUT1, but no data is being transmitted to INPUT2, INPUT1 will be displayed.
• •
  If data is being transmitted to INPUT2, but no data is being transmitted to INPUT1, INPUT2 will be displayed

Later, in Para 2.3.1, it says:
ALLOW AUTO SWITCH = YES (LABEL 100P)
Setting this to YES (LABEL 100P) allows the GPS Navigator to tell SkyView to switch from GPS to ILS or back when on an ILS overlay approach. SkyView will display whatever mode the GPS Navigator tells SkyView. When in this mode, and not on an approach, switching between the NAV function and GPS function must be performed from the GPS Navigator.

I have a GPS 175 and VAL Nav 2000 VOR/ILS Nav receiver, and it does this automatically for me, regardless of whether I am flying a Dynon Skyview flight plan or a Garmin PPS 175 Flight Plan.

 

[frogman208]

Unfortunately that doesn't work for the Trig TX56 since it uses only serial port instead of the SV-ARINC 429 line. The "LABEL 100P" is if your connected via 429 it will auto switch between whatever you have as Nav 1 (such as GPS) and Nav 2 (such as LOC) but both sources have to be connected to the 429 line (I believe but not sure). Section Para 2.3.1 specifically talks about the SV-ARINC 429 (or I just call the 429 line) and not serial port connections. Maybe if Trig updates the TX56 to ARINC, then it would work. Right now I have to manually change between SRC CDI's. Quick question. I thought the VAL Nav 2000 is connected by serial port also? How are you getting that to work? To switch the "LABEL 100P" you have to go into the SV-ARINC 429 setting and select yes or no. What does that have to do with Serial port setting or does a serial port also talk/take date from the ARINC 429 line. Very Curious.

 

[cbretana]

Ahh, my VAL Nav 2000 also uses a serial port. The setting I am talking about on the ARCINC-429 is for the Garmin GPS 175 / GNX 375 / GNC 355. The only requirement for this to function as I described is the the Nav receiver on the serial port has to communicate using the SL30 protocol.

Don't be confused by the use of INPUT1, & INPUT2 terminology in the manuals. It does not mean that the system only switches between ARCINC-429 inputs.

My VAL NAV 2000 uses a serial port, but communicates using Garmin SL30 protocol, and the Skyview system functions as I describe above.

Does the Trig unit use the SL30 protocol?

 

[frogman208]

Yes it does, thank you for explaining that. I’ll do the switch and report how it goes. Thanks for the tip that’s not explained well in the Dynon manual

 

[cbretana]

Your question makes me wonder if I am misinterpreting some other behavioral aspect of this. I have asked Don Jones at Dynon in another thread...

 

[frogman208]

Here is a YouTube video I made this morning that shows my setup for a flight. Mind the blabble as I’m not a YouTube person. I believe I have it set up like I like to fly. Really what I was looking for was how to keep the Garmin 355 map on display while I fly the green needles on an approach. I explain why in the video. It’s because the 355 shows the missed procedure way points even for ILS/BOR/LOC. I think I have it now. Also I already have “yes” selected on the 429 line but it doesn’t automatically transfer the nav source from GPS to NAV (Trig), I toggle it with the SRC button. Sorry for the raw video but best I could do right now. Video below

Dynon