The problems came back for me I guess I spoke to soon. But whats funny is the computer thet quit loading SA about 7 months ago started working again and the one I have been using recently has the problems with SA that the original computer did. They both run Windows 7. :-/
I am SO sick of the SA app
- Thread starter swatson999
- Start date
Carl_Froehlich
Active Member
- Joined
- Aug 22, 2007
- Messages
- 307
I got a note yesterday from Steve at Seattle Avionics on the issue:
Steve Podradchik, Aug 21, 14:57:
Hi Carl,
We have just released a new version of the Data Manager that fixes a problem that affected a small number of users, probably including you.
Please click 'Update Now' for the new version to be automatically installed. The new version is 5.1.6.0516 (shown in the lower left corner of the app).
Should this version not automatically install (sometimes happens because of Windows security settings), you can manually download and install it from:
http://chartdata.seattleavionics.com/Apps/DataManagerSetup.exe
Please let us know how it goes. And sorry for the problem.
Should this new version NOT resolve the problem, please send us a log file generated by the Data Manager by clicking the Options button then Advanced then 'Email log file to Support'
Thanks, Steve
I updated the Data Manager to version 5.1.6.0516 and let it run all night. It now works.
Carl
Steve Podradchik, Aug 21, 14:57:
Hi Carl,
We have just released a new version of the Data Manager that fixes a problem that affected a small number of users, probably including you.
Please click 'Update Now' for the new version to be automatically installed. The new version is 5.1.6.0516 (shown in the lower left corner of the app).
Should this version not automatically install (sometimes happens because of Windows security settings), you can manually download and install it from:
http://chartdata.seattleavionics.com/Apps/DataManagerSetup.exe
Please let us know how it goes. And sorry for the problem.
Should this new version NOT resolve the problem, please send us a log file generated by the Data Manager by clicking the Options button then Advanced then 'Email log file to Support'
Thanks, Steve
I updated the Data Manager to version 5.1.6.0516 and let it run all night. It now works.
Carl
As a long time user and supporter of Skyview I have to agree that the process of updating the system is one of the least appealing in the industry. I uploaded the new SA uploader and sure enough it doesn't work. I also cannot get ANY response from SA. This leaves me without charts on the skyview. Yes, I also have charts on the IPAD and no - I will not upload them into Skyview because I want redundancy (2 sets of charts) because of the amount of IFR flying I do. Dynon's reputation is only as good as who they recommend to support their product. SA is not providing a quality product to Dynon users. Its way past time for Dynon (yes Dynon, not SA) to correct this situation and provide their users with a simple, fast method for using their product, like their competitors do. DYNON - are you listening?????
Hey Dave, I just don't see how this is Dynon's problem? They have their own charts, which work great for VFR, as far as I can see. Sounds more like and Seattle Avionics problem to me, but then again, I'm not using the SA charts. My backup is Jeppesen Mobile Flight Deck VFR, on an ipad mini. So, what am I missing??........Tom
60av8tor
New Member
You know, I've really enjoyed dealing with Dynon in the past, but this issue has left a bad taste in my mouth. I 100% agree with Dave on this one. It's simply my opinion, Tom, but if a manufacturer uses a third party for a part, feature, etc, the manufacturer has to suffer the problems with that part or feature. Dynon sure as heck touts charts and plates as a benefit of owning a SV system, but if I have problems with it...deal directly with SA. And their service is the antithesis of Dynon's (when dealing with other issues anyway). Dynon is always very responsive on this forum, but on this topic....? They even state on their site to go VFR direct to SA. To me, that's just poor. And I'll vote with my wallet during my next panel build.
turbopilot
Member
No excuses for SA. They should be much better than they are.
But we do need a reality check trying to duplicate charts on these devices. The 10" Dynon Touch panel is 1024x600 pixels. Garmin G3X panel is 1280x768 pixels. While Garmin's panel has slightly more resolution, in my opinion, neither panel is suitable for rendering standard VFR and IFR charts well in the cockpit. Those panels are much better suited to basic navigation and systems monitoring than they are to charting. The issue is of even more importance with presbyopic pilots.
I use charts on an iPad Retina Mini running ForeFlight. ForeFlight handles updates well and the charts on an iPad Retina Mini are very close to looking at a paper chart in the cockpit.
So until Dynon (and Garmin) come out with a high resolution displays I think using charts on these low resolution panels is not worth it when you have a fully wonderful EFB running with the iPad Mini and ForeFlight which also provides navigation redundancy if you need it.
Now that we have WiFi connectivity between Skyview and iPad/ForeFlight, I wonder if Dynon could persuade ForeFlight to just pass over charting from the iPad to the Skyview display. Would only need the VFR or IFR chart displayed around the current position so it should not require a lot of bandwidth.
But we do need a reality check trying to duplicate charts on these devices. The 10" Dynon Touch panel is 1024x600 pixels. Garmin G3X panel is 1280x768 pixels. While Garmin's panel has slightly more resolution, in my opinion, neither panel is suitable for rendering standard VFR and IFR charts well in the cockpit. Those panels are much better suited to basic navigation and systems monitoring than they are to charting. The issue is of even more importance with presbyopic pilots.
I use charts on an iPad Retina Mini running ForeFlight. ForeFlight handles updates well and the charts on an iPad Retina Mini are very close to looking at a paper chart in the cockpit.
So until Dynon (and Garmin) come out with a high resolution displays I think using charts on these low resolution panels is not worth it when you have a fully wonderful EFB running with the iPad Mini and ForeFlight which also provides navigation redundancy if you need it.
Now that we have WiFi connectivity between Skyview and iPad/ForeFlight, I wonder if Dynon could persuade ForeFlight to just pass over charting from the iPad to the Skyview display. Would only need the VFR or IFR chart displayed around the current position so it should not require a lot of bandwidth.
Tom - If you bought a Ford and they advertised it had brakes on it and you had a brake problem would you have to go straight to the 3rd party manufacturer of the brakes? Of course not. Quite simply, my missions involve IFR, my Skyview is capable of having the charts on it. I paid both Dynon and SA to have the charts on it. SA is not delivering the product. Enough said.
As for the resolution and size of the charts, I have never experienced an issue thanks to the ability to zoom in on the charts. I typically use the Foreflight charts because they upload so easily which provides a comfort factor. The Skyview charts are my backup for IFR.
I have owned about every piece of hardware Dynon makes and they have provided excellent customer service on all fronts with the mysterious exception of this one. There must be more to this situation than what Dynon is admitting. With all of the competition out there this should be the #1 priority, not another firmware update with more bells and whistles. Dyson - fix the system as it is first. Its broken.
As for the resolution and size of the charts, I have never experienced an issue thanks to the ability to zoom in on the charts. I typically use the Foreflight charts because they upload so easily which provides a comfort factor. The Skyview charts are my backup for IFR.
I have owned about every piece of hardware Dynon makes and they have provided excellent customer service on all fronts with the mysterious exception of this one. There must be more to this situation than what Dynon is admitting. With all of the competition out there this should be the #1 priority, not another firmware update with more bells and whistles. Dyson - fix the system as it is first. Its broken.
If I understand what you guys re saying, Dynon/Seattle Avionics systems are not performing well in the IFR arena. As a VFR pilot of a homebuilt aircraft, for the dollars spent, I have been exceeding pleased with the performance of my Skyview system. Sure, there are probably some terrific TSO'd products out there that will out perform my Skyview, and are legal IFR boxes, but I was looking for an affordable VFR solution, and I think that I found it with these guys. Sorry for your troubles, and I hope that you get satisfactory resolution, whoever is responsible. I just keep seeing software upgrades, 28 day cycle navigation data base updates, terrain updates, etc., All FREE. I don't want to see any of that go away .........Tom
- Joined
- Mar 23, 2005
- Messages
- 13,226
Please know that Dynon is not ignoring this thread. The majority of posts are in the last three days, one of which is a weekend day, and we can't fix the issue or promise a specific fix in that timeframe, so we have been a bit silent.
It is Dynon's job to make sure that our customers have good access to data even when that data is provided and sold by third parties. We do appreciate our customers telling us how big of an issue this is and that it needs to be fixed. You can be assured that we will look into this aggressively and figure out how to make it right. We're glad that the SkyViiew side appears to work well for everyone and that the charts and plates feature is well used when the data is available.
Give us a few days so we can work with Seattle Avionics and outline a path to make this a great user experience.
--Ian Jordan
Dynon Avionics
It is Dynon's job to make sure that our customers have good access to data even when that data is provided and sold by third parties. We do appreciate our customers telling us how big of an issue this is and that it needs to be fixed. You can be assured that we will look into this aggressively and figure out how to make it right. We're glad that the SkyViiew side appears to work well for everyone and that the charts and plates feature is well used when the data is available.
Give us a few days so we can work with Seattle Avionics and outline a path to make this a great user experience.
--Ian Jordan
Dynon Avionics
I'm a lost on why the blame is being placed on Dynon. You're buying the service from Seattle Avionics. Dynon helps supplement the cost of your SA subscription. So, they are also the end customer.
It's like blaming Directv for Fox playing sports over an episode of Firefly. Not really Directv's fault.
It's like blaming Directv for Fox playing sports over an episode of Firefly. Not really Directv's fault.
60av8tor
New Member
No.... It's like Direct TV offering the Fox network, you pay for the subscription, but can only receive the network 4 months out of the year. Direct TV says, "yeah, Fox is sketchy, take it up with them". I can see your argument, IF Dynon didn't advertise this feature, but rather make a statement like I've seen in other instances to the effect of, this third party service is available, but Dynon makes no claim to the reliability, yada, yada, yada. Then, sure, I'm on my own. I appreciate Ian's response, and I will continue with the monthly frustration and hope for a program that is a little less 1995 in the future.
Ian - thanks for a quick response. I truly didn't expect any response over the weekend. It just goes to show the level of great customer care Dynon has produced. Now for the tricky part..........can the problem be fixed? How will it be fixed? When will it be fixed? This is not the first posting about SA's problems, its been ongoing for a long time.
rvator51
Member
Hi Ian,
What about some version of this scenerio? SA puts an option on their Data Manager software to zip up the entire download of the options that the user has selected into one zip file. So there is only one large download, then the user can unzip and then copy the folders to his USB stick at his convenience. I guess it would take some user knowledge about copy/paste, etc. But I am thinking the download might be a lot faster and less chances of problems. Then since you have the entire charts for the options you want, you could delete all of the folders on your USB and just copy the complete folders you downloaded over to the USB stick. Might be an interim fix until the data manager gets reliable for all users.
What about some version of this scenerio? SA puts an option on their Data Manager software to zip up the entire download of the options that the user has selected into one zip file. So there is only one large download, then the user can unzip and then copy the folders to his USB stick at his convenience. I guess it would take some user knowledge about copy/paste, etc. But I am thinking the download might be a lot faster and less chances of problems. Then since you have the entire charts for the options you want, you could delete all of the folders on your USB and just copy the complete folders you downloaded over to the USB stick. Might be an interim fix until the data manager gets reliable for all users.
Here's a data point:
I was one of the leaders in bashing SA about a year or year and a half ago when they had some serious problems with both download and support. Then they revamped their download software, and I have had no problems since.
After reading this thread, and in need of an SA update fix, I downloaded an update this morning. I have 16 states, a USB-2 drive, and running Win Xp. It took about 3 hours on a 10 Mbs connection. The program asked at the outset whether I had SV Ver 13 - I said yes - and it did its thing.
So, I had, and have had, no problem, since SA changed their update software. Like I said - just another data point. Because, some people have major problems, and some have none, it could well be this is related to the user's equipment. It was for me way back when, which is why I switched from a Win 7 machine to Xp. Once it worked for me, I stuck with it. I'm like that - if it ain't broke, you know.... Maybe a lot of the complaints should be directed to MS Redmond. It won't be their first. You DID say, Jon, it worked on a Win 7 machine, but not on a Win 8. Big clue there!
Those who think Dynon should shoulder the problems at SA, might contemplate adding MS as another third party supplier that is screwing up the works. Good luck there!
What I find somewhat irksome is this incessant drumbeat threatening to go Garmin, or stating "That's it - I'm going Garmin." What's that line about "don't let the door....."
I have some Garmin gear, played with their stuff at the shows, talked with their people. I sure don't think they win this horse race hands down. Having SV Touch, I know first hand what a touch screen is like in rough air. I sure wouldn't want that to be my only interface, or I'd go back to steam gauges.
All glass panels have a lot of Wow! factor - I'd say Garmin and Dynon are probably a push and very subject to personal preference.
As far as after sale support and service, I don't think there is any comparison. Dynon is clearly the class act of the industry. For me, that's a VERY major consideration in any high value purchase.
Now, in writing this, I decided to saunter over to the Garmin Forums to see what's going on at the Big G. After a half hour googling and searching Garmin's Forums, I've yet to find anything on the G3X. They need a log-in and password to even get in - and I have them. But I can't find any Forums for the G3X. Maybe someone else can supply the url.
Or maybe there isn't one.
Bob Bogash
RV-12
N737G
I was one of the leaders in bashing SA about a year or year and a half ago when they had some serious problems with both download and support. Then they revamped their download software, and I have had no problems since.
After reading this thread, and in need of an SA update fix, I downloaded an update this morning. I have 16 states, a USB-2 drive, and running Win Xp. It took about 3 hours on a 10 Mbs connection. The program asked at the outset whether I had SV Ver 13 - I said yes - and it did its thing.
So, I had, and have had, no problem, since SA changed their update software. Like I said - just another data point. Because, some people have major problems, and some have none, it could well be this is related to the user's equipment. It was for me way back when, which is why I switched from a Win 7 machine to Xp. Once it worked for me, I stuck with it. I'm like that - if it ain't broke, you know.... Maybe a lot of the complaints should be directed to MS Redmond. It won't be their first. You DID say, Jon, it worked on a Win 7 machine, but not on a Win 8. Big clue there!
Those who think Dynon should shoulder the problems at SA, might contemplate adding MS as another third party supplier that is screwing up the works. Good luck there!
What I find somewhat irksome is this incessant drumbeat threatening to go Garmin, or stating "That's it - I'm going Garmin." What's that line about "don't let the door....."
I have some Garmin gear, played with their stuff at the shows, talked with their people. I sure don't think they win this horse race hands down. Having SV Touch, I know first hand what a touch screen is like in rough air. I sure wouldn't want that to be my only interface, or I'd go back to steam gauges.
All glass panels have a lot of Wow! factor - I'd say Garmin and Dynon are probably a push and very subject to personal preference.
As far as after sale support and service, I don't think there is any comparison. Dynon is clearly the class act of the industry. For me, that's a VERY major consideration in any high value purchase.
Now, in writing this, I decided to saunter over to the Garmin Forums to see what's going on at the Big G. After a half hour googling and searching Garmin's Forums, I've yet to find anything on the G3X. They need a log-in and password to even get in - and I have them. But I can't find any Forums for the G3X. Maybe someone else can supply the url.
Or maybe there isn't one.
Bob Bogash
RV-12
N737G
60av8tor
New Member
I "DID" say that, Bob. And yes, maybe it would be a "big clue" if it wouldn't work one month (yes, on WIN 8) and then randomly not work the next. Again, I'm downloading files, not curing cancer with this program.
You know what I find, irksome, Bob? People that admit to similar previous behavior, but now preach because they don't personally have issues. Obviously since SA revamped the program, and it now works for you, other issues couldn't be due to SA DM, right :
Using XP in order to make a software program work...I'll get right on that... WIN 8 doesn't work for me, so I successfully use WIN 7. WIN 7 doesn't work for you, so you successfully use XP. Yup, a well sorted software program. I pity the poor SOB who has to go back to WIN 95 to make it work. And thanks, I won't let the door hit me.
rfazio1951
Member
- Joined
- Feb 11, 2010
- Messages
- 356
Mine works! I've been using SA from early on. Never had a problem. This month I did get the charts left in red! Then it updated the loader and all is well. I have a fast internet connection and it updates in about 30 minutes to a USB 3.0 stick.
W
William_Ince
Guest
I may as well chime in also . . . .
Using MacBook (13-inch, Aluminum, Late 2008), processor is 2.4 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, memory is 8 GB 1067 MHz DDR3.
I am using VMWare Fusion, to run Windows XP Pro (with service pack 3).
My thumb drives (I use 2) are SanDisk Cruzer Fit CZ33 16GB USB 2.0 Low-Profile Flash Drive - SDCZ33-016G-B35
These thumb drives were recommended by Dynon.
SkyView version 12.0, works flawlessly.
I usually download Seattle Avionics VFR chart data for 4 states, including Sectionals, airport diagrams and approach procedures.
Each thumb drive completes in less than 45 minutes, usually without any errors.
Overall, it has worked pretty good, no complaints other than slow load times. Since SkyView version 12 works so well, I do not plan on using SkyView version 13 anytime soon.
Note: Tech support at SA could certainly be a lot better. The Dynon customer support model would be a vast improvement. Thank you Dynon!
Using MacBook (13-inch, Aluminum, Late 2008), processor is 2.4 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, memory is 8 GB 1067 MHz DDR3.
I am using VMWare Fusion, to run Windows XP Pro (with service pack 3).
My thumb drives (I use 2) are SanDisk Cruzer Fit CZ33 16GB USB 2.0 Low-Profile Flash Drive - SDCZ33-016G-B35
These thumb drives were recommended by Dynon.
SkyView version 12.0, works flawlessly.
I usually download Seattle Avionics VFR chart data for 4 states, including Sectionals, airport diagrams and approach procedures.
Each thumb drive completes in less than 45 minutes, usually without any errors.
Overall, it has worked pretty good, no complaints other than slow load times. Since SkyView version 12 works so well, I do not plan on using SkyView version 13 anytime soon.
Note: Tech support at SA could certainly be a lot better. The Dynon customer support model would be a vast improvement. Thank you Dynon!
Seems like a good place to make this input. I experienced the same issue whereby the Airport Diagrams (AD's) and Approach Plates (IAP's) would not finish downloading on my SA Data Manager, i.e. turn the buttons on the computer side to green from yellow. I experienced the problem on Thurs the 20th and called SA tech support. Got rapid assistance which did not solve the problem. But on Friday after they had studied my 2 data logs, and having worked most of the night, Steve from SA called, took control of my computer and in about an hour had solved the problem and written the change for everyone which appears on the bottom left of the Data Manager panel as version 5.1.6.0156. If this version number is not on your Data Manager your current AD and IAP downloads to the computer won't work (finish). My hat is off to SA on this one. Fixed my problem and issued the program update before the end of the day Friday Aug 21. Took a little over 24 hours from problem announcement to solution. Takes a little more time to get the word out. Jack Lindsay, The Villages, FL , N1AD, RV-8A
For those of you on this thread, can you confirm whether or not 5.1.6.0156 solves your problem? And if it doesn't, can you briefly state (if it's not extremely clear from your prior posts) what exact issue you're experiencing? There are a few different symptoms here that I want to make sure we have discrete understanding of.
From our end, in the short term, we're going to start being a little more active in helping support our and Seattle Avionics' common customers. Over the longer term, I cant' share too much right now. But suffice it to say that we really care about your complete experience with Dynon products, even when we don't have control over every aspect of those experiences. As some of you have pointed out, there are a variety of ways that we can improve this over the long term, and we're going to take a hard look at them.
From our end, in the short term, we're going to start being a little more active in helping support our and Seattle Avionics' common customers. Over the longer term, I cant' share too much right now. But suffice it to say that we really care about your complete experience with Dynon products, even when we don't have control over every aspect of those experiences. As some of you have pointed out, there are a variety of ways that we can improve this over the long term, and we're going to take a hard look at them.