SkyView 12.0 Now Available

mikehoover

New Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2005
Messages
63
As simple as it is, this one is a great improvement:

Improved: Map zoom/range feature can be reversed so that clockwise rotation "zooms in" to the map (decreases range) to suit user preference.

It is more intuitive to have 'screw in, screw out' - "zoom in, zoom out".

Thanks Dynon!
 

Exbonanzabucko

I love flying!
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Jun 30, 2014
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I am having trouble finding the places in the Skyview users's manual where there are instructions on how to do some of the new things in V12.  Specifically where would I find out how to send and receive frequencies from Garmin GTR 200 and where would I find out how to set up In Air Magnetic Calibration? 

BTW: The online version of the new manual shows changes in Blue not Red as advertised....doesn't really matter but it's interesting.
 
 

preid

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Jan 22, 2010
Messages
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SoCal
confirm- it is INSTALLATION manual where the Serial and calibrations are documented.
For the OBS mode steps that is in User manual pg 7-52
same with changing the airplane icon
Don't recall where the AP Roll guidance is so here is that step (ROLL TRIM IN AUTOPILOT- (AP SETUP / ROLL AXIS)
and for the CRSR change from Clockwise to counterclockwise for Zoom- MAP MENU > MAP MODE >
 

preid

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Jan 22, 2010
Messages
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Tested out the new features in the air today. The magnetic calibration was very easy to complete, liked the AP Roll guidance, but what I really liked was how, for the first time since v4, I had a upgrade go quickly and upgrade all hardware without need to "force" the upgrade.
It is great to see the constant improvements Dynon continues to make with each version.
Kudos on this version upgrade! Look forward to news on the WiFi functionality.
 

Exbonanzabucko

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Jun 30, 2014
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I hate to be a grouch but I just printed out the "red line" annotated version of the Installation Guide so I could get details on how to execute most of the changes in Version 12.  It's 405 pages long and 3 inches high and it used up all my printer's paper and three of my ink cartridges.

There must be a better way.  I'm tempted to mumble words like "bush league" and "not ready for prime time"....but I won't because the people at Dynon are very nice people and I don't want to make them feel bad.

EBB:)
 

preid

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Don;
on your ipad go to http://www.dynonavionics.com/docs/support_documentation.html
open the document you want and it will download to your ipad. I have ibooks and it gives me the option to open using ibooks, which in turn saves it to your ibooks library for on demand access
 

DonFromTX

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Dec 4, 2011
Messages
282
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Texas
Thanks, I can handle that. Just had not thought of that method to get it done. This seems like such a far better way to keep the latest manual handy.
 

jakej

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Oct 10, 2007
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Adelaide, Australia
I hate to be a grouch but I just printed out the "red line" annotated version of the Installation Guide so I could get details on how to execute most of the changes in Version 12.  It's 405 pages long and 3 inches high and it used up all my printer's paper and three of my ink cartridges.

There must be a better way.  I'm tempted to mumble words like "bush league" and "not ready for prime time"....but I won't because the people at Dynon are very nice people and I don't want to make them feel bad.

EBB:)

I hear you  ;D ;D , didn't someone say "be careful what you wish for " ?  I'm referring to the constant harping for new features as it just translates to larger install manuals  ::)  & we know a few people, or two, don't have the time or inclination to read them  :)

Jake J
 

DonFromTX

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Messages
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I use the principle that if it is so confusing to operate that you need a manual, then just try to figure it out for yourself. Gets me in a LOT of trouble sometimes.
I hate to be a grouch but I just printed out the "red line" annotated version of the Installation Guide so I could get details on how to execute most of the changes in Version 12.  It's 405 pages long and 3 inches high and it used up all my printer's paper and three of my ink cartridges.

There must be a better way.  I'm tempted to mumble words like "bush league" and "not ready for prime time"....but I won't because the people at Dynon are very nice people and I don't want to make them feel bad.

EBB:)

I hear you  ;D ;D , didn't someone say "be careful what you wish for " ?  I'm referring to the constant harping for new features as it just translates to larger install manuals  ::)  & we know a few people, or two, don't have the time or inclination to read them  :)

Jake J
 

NASA515

I love flying!
Joined
Oct 23, 2012
Messages
169
I hate to be a grouch but I just printed out the "red line" annotated version of the Installation Guide so I could get details on how to execute most of the changes in Version 12.  It's 405 pages long and 3 inches high and it used up all my printer's paper and three of my ink cartridges.

There must be a better way.  I'm tempted to mumble words like "bush league" and "not ready for prime time"....but I won't because the people at Dynon are very nice people and I don't want to make them feel bad.

EBB:)


Go ahead, EBB, use words like "bush league" - just like you did over on VAF.  Stuff that made you so popular on that Forum.   Dynon's publications are absolutely superb - I've been in this aviation manual business for 50 years and can't recall better.  The new red line (or blue line or whatever color you want to call it) is nothing short of fantastic and makes determining the adds and subtractions a dream.

Dynon rolls their Firmware 3 or 4 times a year  accompanied by updates to the Operating and Installation Manuals.  Duh!   The Ops Manual is 230 pages and the Installation Manual is 401.  If you want the Ops Change Manual - that's another 239.  That's 839 pages for your printer.  Four changes a year would generate about 3500 pages.  You better stock up on printer cartridges and lots of paper.

Of course, you could read the manuals as PDF files on your computer or tablet or whatever - like a lot of people do.  They're better as PDF too, unless you print them out in color, the copies will all be B&W.  You must have down-loaded the PDF files, or you couldn't print them out.  I personally can't imagine printing all those pages out, but, different strokes.

I personally love each new Firmware release as it's always chock full of great new goodies.  And devouring the Manual so I can see how to use all my new toys.

I don't know what would be "a better way"?  How about not printing out all those pages?  Or you could just skip reading the Manual, like so many seem wont to do, and if you get stuck, just post a question on one of the Forums.

Of course, Dynon could also just quit upgrading the Firmware, so you wouldn't have to print any more pages and buy any more printer cartridges.

Bob Bogash
RV-12
N737G
 

dynonsupport

Dynon Technical Support
Staff member
Joined
Mar 23, 2005
Messages
13,226
As a reminder, S-LSA aircraft cannot update software without authorization from the OEM, and instructions on how to set up any changes that need to be made, so in general, our install manual is not particularity relevant to someone with an S-LSA.
 

DBRV10

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Jun 15, 2008
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Brisbane, Qld. Australia
Dynon actually sets a pretty high standard for avionics manufacturers to compete with. Compared to the certified world where the big G dominate, Dynon are miles in front.

I am with you Bob. Dynon rocks! :D
 

Exbonanzabucko

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Jun 30, 2014
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Well Bob as an expert on aviation manuals maybe this will help you understand what I mean by "bush league" for Dynon's documentation: 

On page 4-20 of the Installation Guide the GTR 200 procedure is detailed.  But if you enter the set up menu on the Skyview in your airplane you will find that the choices are Garmin SL40 or "None" when picking the  radio to use.  No mention of the GTR 200 is made.  That is "bush league"....the guide was not proof read. I talked with Mike Scoffield at Dynon about this and he agreed that this should  have been better. 

Then, there's another problem:  On page 5-6 the procedure for In Flight Compass Calibration is detailed.  It seems to me that a prudent pilot would want bring the set up pages for that up on the ground before doing the inflight routine.  But that procedure won't come up.  It turns out that the set up pages for the will only display after you are in the air.  But the guide says nothing about that.  I called Dynon Tech support and they didn't have an answer for this without some minutes of checking.

I submit that not proof reading an Installation Guide for a piece of avionics equipment critical to flight safety is "Bush League."  And I submit that, since you have been in the manual business for 50 years you might be able to "recall better."  Perhaps you had a problem with proofreading too in those 50 years.

I'm sorry that you cannot deal with critical commentary on this stuff without getting cross about it.  I also am sorry that my confidence in Dynon has been bent a little by this.

Have a good day,
EBB:)

I hate to be a grouch but I just printed out the "red line" annotated version of the Installation Guide so I could get details on how to execute most of the changes in Version 12.  It's 405 pages long and 3 inches high and it used up all my printer's paper and three of my ink cartridges.

There must be a better way.  I'm tempted to mumble words like "bush league" and "not ready for prime time"....but I won't because the people at Dynon are very nice people and I don't want to make them feel bad.

EBB:)


Go ahead, EBB, use words like "bush league" - just like you did over on VAF.  Stuff that made you so popular on that Forum.   Dynon's publications are absolutely superb - I've been in this aviation manual business for 50 years and can't recall better.  The new red line (or blue line or whatever color you want to call it) is nothing short of fantastic and makes determining the adds and subtractions a dream.

Dynon rolls their Firmware 3 or 4 times a year  accompanied by updates to the Operating and Installation Manuals.  Duh!   The Ops Manual is 230 pages and the Installation Manual is 401.  If you want the Ops Change Manual - that's another 239.  That's 839 pages for your printer.  Four changes a year would generate about 3500 pages.  You better stock up on printer cartridges and lots of paper.

Of course, you could read the manuals as PDF files on your computer or tablet or whatever - like a lot of people do.  They're better as PDF too, unless you print them out in color, the copies will all be B&W.  You must have down-loaded the PDF files, or you couldn't print them out.  I personally can't imagine printing all those pages out, but, different strokes.

I personally love each new Firmware release as it's always chock full of great new goodies.  And devouring the Manual so I can see how to use all my new toys.

I don't know what would be "a better way"?  How about not printing out all those pages?  Or you could just skip reading the Manual, like so many seem wont to do, and if you get stuck, just post a question on one of the Forums.

Of course, Dynon could also just quit upgrading the Firmware, so you wouldn't have to print any more pages and buy any more printer cartridges.

Bob Bogash
RV-12
N737G
 

NASA515

I love flying!
Joined
Oct 23, 2012
Messages
169
Why don't you say what's on your mind, Bruce, instead of beating around the "bush."  Your first post opined "I'm tempted to mutter words like bush league" when you weren't "tempted" at all, as everyone knew.  In your present post you came right out and said it - several times:

"That is 'bush league'"

Yes, Bruce, in my career, I missed a few proof-reading errors, and worse.  I worked for Boeing, and they were strictly "Bush League", and "...not ready for Prime Time."  Not First Class, like Beech, I guess.  I would suggest in 839 pages of technical manuals there are opportunities to miss a few things, and do some things better.

The important thing about Dynon, in my experience, is their responsiveness to comments and criticisms, and their willingness, indeed eagerness, to address both problems and customers' wants and desires.  They are a small company in the ring with an 800 lb gorilla and their pluckiness and customer responsiveness are a pleasure to observe and deal with.  I suggest you try having a technical discussion with the folks down the road at Brand "G" and see what your experiences are.

"I'm sorry that you cannot deal with critical commentary on this stuff without getting cross about it.  I also am sorry that my confidence in Dynon has been bent a little by this."

Bruce, many of us read your stuff on the various Forums.  We already know your confidence in Vans has "been bent a little", and your confidence in Rotax has "been bent a little", so it comes as no surprise that now Dynon has joined your List and your confidence in them "has been bent a little."

Perhaps it's time to reflect a bit, Bruce.  After all, you did say I hate to be a grouch.

Pointing out errors and omissions in technical documentation is a good thing. Calling them Bush League is not a constructive way to achieve your goals, which are, sometimes, Our Goals as well.

Webster defines Bush League as being of an inferior class or group of its kind .  That hardly describes Dynon.  In fact, it is an insult.

Bob Bogash
RV-12
N737G
 

dynonsupport

Dynon Technical Support
Staff member
Joined
Mar 23, 2005
Messages
13,226
EBB,
Thanks for your feedback on the install guide. We do proofread our guides, but with the number of updates we do, and the complexity of our product, it's inevitable that some things will be missed. We try our best, and we're actually very proud of our manuals. In this industry, the standard is "no manual". Lots of our competitors release multiple software updates without even doing a manual revision, much less trying to do ones with change logs. We of course will take your feedback and use it to make our manual better.

One communication issue here is that you first complained about the redlined manual, as if the method we use to communicate changes is insufficient. However, now you are discussing actual information that is in the manual, not the way it was released. It's a bit unclear what you ever wanted out of the redlined manual now that you are discussing something else entirely.

We've had long discussions here on the forum about how hard it is to keep a clean document that shows only changes, and again is not standard at all in the industry, Experimental GA or Certified GA. Go look at Garmin's manuals for a G1000. There is not a change document, only the new revision, and even that has only a minimal change table. We know the redlined document is not 100% what some customers want, but it's the best we can do with limited resources, a limited market size, and it seems to have made a majority of customers happier than before.

In the end, if your definition of "bush league" is that a product release is not 100% perfect, then I imagine you are going to be disappointed with most modern products. Garmin, Apple, Honda, Beechcraft, GM, Sony, Microsoft all release products that have bugs either in documentation, and just as often the actual function of the product itself. For example, a change log for the Garmin 430 lists:
Corrected the issue, addressed in SA 1047 and IB 1048, in which CDI (Course Deviation Indicator)/HSI (Horizontal Situation Indicator) scaling on a limited number of LNAV/VNAV and LNAV+V approaches was incorrect.
Yep, a fully certified GPS navigator gave you the wrong CDI indication sometimes. This is just the reality of products that are designed and tested by people. If Dynon's worst transgression is that they called a GTR200 a SL40 in an install manual, but a certified navigator can mislead your in IFR, I'd hate to think of what you'd call Garmin. I'm not even sure of what to think of Beechcraft that hides their service bulletins behind the requirement to pay for a subscription to read them.

The unacceptable thing in aviation is not to have made a mistake, it's to not learn from it. We know that as pilots and as product designers. It's why the aviation world has service bulletins, airworthiness directives. Dynon has a robust reporting, tracking, and corrections system, which allows us to be sure that we do learn from our errors and continue to make our products better. We look forward to your continued input and we'll incorporate it to make our products better.

Finally, it does appear that you have installed 12.0 on your S-LSA. We must re-iterate that this is not allowed and technically your aircraft is no longer conforming and cannot be operated legally in the USA, as the OEM has not released authorization for 12.0 in the RV-12 S-LSA.

--Ian Jordan
 

rvator51

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Sep 21, 2007
Messages
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Location
Peoria, AZ
On page 4-20 of the Installation Guide the GTR 200 procedure is detailed.  But if you enter the set up menu on the Skyview in your airplane you will find that the choices are Garmin SL40 or "None" when picking the  radio to use.  No mention of the GTR 200 is made.  That is "bush league"....

Hi EBB,
I wonder if you are running version 12 software because the manual on page 4-20 is correct.  The GTR 200 is one of the versions that comes up.  I can see that you could have a problem if you are running an earlier version of software and are looking at the latest documentation and it doesnt match your screen.

Here is a screen capture of the set up for the GTR-200
 

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rvator51

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Peoria, AZ
Here is a screen shot of selecting the GTR-200 as the primary COM.
 

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