ADSB 472

swatson999

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Reply #153--Here at Reno Stead (RTS) we have drone testing several days a week when the wx allows.  I have the Dynon ADS-B in and out and iFly with Ping Buddy and I see the small drones flying North of the of the field all the time.  I believe they are transmitting with the Ping Buddy, not verified but I do see them on the Dynon and iFly.  They don't have standard N numbers, but numbers starting with various letters.  Dan from Reno

Yeah, but it's not *required* by the FAA for all those millions of consumer drones, and likely never will be. That means that nearly all of them will never show up via ADS-B (nor should they, since they're supposed to be < 400' AGL...and someone willing to break that rule will almost certainly disable any XPDR on his drone, anyway).
 
W

William_Ince

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I really like my Skyview system, but a pox upon Dynon for not embracing a published protocol (GDL90) unlike organizations like Avidyne, Advanced, GRT, and others have done.   Dynon can't deliver, and their proprietary approach has negatively impacted their customers because of it.
I agree 100%.  Dynon's position in this makes them look like the dark side supplier Brand G.

I think Dynon's initial position was understandable, but technology has overtaken them and their strategy is fizzling before their eyes.  Best they contemplate their navel and throw in the towel on this one.

The 470 was their going-in position, and it was noble.  And it works.  Priced reasonably at about $1200.  But then we, the customer base, complained about not having the dual freq capability.  So, they responded with the 472.  Dual freq solutions began appearing in the marketplace at ever lower prices.  One was uAvionix's PingBuddy.  I posted here about it.  Then came the PingBuddy 2. $149. Dynon must be reading this stuff, for lo and behold, the Ping Buddy seems to have been adopted as a quick and dirty solution to dual freq in, with their circuit board showing up in the 472 ("powered by uAvionix.")  New price - $795.  Smaller, Better, Cheaper.

Meanwhile, it seems everyone and his uncle began banging these ADS-B IN boxes together in their garage and new ones are appearing daily in the $150-200 price range, and some kit built ones for even less.  ADS-B IN is becoming readily available, and on-the-cheap.  Some are good and some are bad, but eventually, they'll be just like a bunch of other tech hardware, they'll become generic, cheap and reliable.

Have you noticed they are being embraced by much of the industry?  ForeFlight has abandoned their long time pal Stratus and are advertising compatibility with these new cheap gadgets.  FlyQ also.  Why, both those vendors are actually selling the Cheapo's on their websites and promoting them in their mailings!  Dynon - are you paying attention?

These new gadgets seem to do a respectable job feeding our tablets.  Using my ipad has never been a satisfactory experience for me, altho I do use it a fair amount.  But I don't want to be grabbing it for traffic alerts, trying to read it while trying to look for the conflict and fly my airplane too.  I want it on my Skyview screen.  My tablet apps can talk back and forth to Skyview via my Wi-Fi dongle.  So why can't this feature as well, either via FF as the intermediary or direct?

The answer is - it could if Dynon wanted to make it possible - via accepting the protocols as described in these threads.  But, they won't.  Initially, they were protecting their market for their $1200 box, which became a $800 box.  Understandable.  But, in my view, this market is evaporating in front of their eyes as the ADS-B IN feeds are soon gonna be $100 gizmos.

Worse yet, they've not only expended the R&D bucks to develop first the 470, and then later the 472, but are now burning cash as they try to solve the problems in the 472.  It seems to me this is now the Hold 'em or Fold 'em time and they would be smart to Fold 'em and cut their losses.

My solution:  Continue to offer the 470, maybe at reduced price; Deep-six the 472; and offer protocol compatibility so that the new new cheap gizmos can talk to Skyview.  Then any disconnects can be referred to the gizmo maker.

Me?  I love these things, but I held off on the 470 because I could see a downward spiral coming in the prices. Guys were selling really cheap and really attractive kits. With upgrades coming every week.   It was clear this was a feature in full development turmoil, and I figured I'd wait until it shook out. I didn't really want to run coax to the back of my ship, install a new antenna, yadda yadda.  I'm still waiting, but I figure Dynon will see the light.

Bob Bogash
Concur totally, with both of you.
uAvionix echoUAT (ADS-B out/in) is looking better and better ($1399).
 

GaryK

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Dynon,
I have been extremely patient during this 472 issue. Great to see you have so many out in the hands of beta users. I asked back on July 17th (post 24) if I could at least get my 470 back until you had a fix. Sure would have been nice to be one of the beta users? In the Grand Rapids, MI area the ADSB drops out all the time, never did that with the 470. Certainly hope the issue is resolved soon one way or the other.

Gary
 

krw5927

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Any updates, Dynon? Can we have GDL90 receive capability already so we can all move on?
 
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William_Ince

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Any updates, Dynon?  Can we have GDL90 receive capability already so we can all move on?
Maybe that is where this is headed.
Which would probably be welcomed by many. . .  :cool:
 

jethound

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Aug 4, 2011
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Unlike many who have had their bowels upset on the 472, I was one of the folks who started this with Dynon, I personally love the equipment, and will deal with any delays necessary to make the system work right.

I have been told that with release of 15.3 the 472 is being addressed. As you know if you have any electronic devices. The technology is moving faster than folks can keep up with it. I am proud to use the Dynon equipment. I fly a Challenger 601-3A.. and Honeywell has refused to even address adding ADS-B to the NZ2000 system. So the only upgrade we get offered is new FMS boxes, A new Panel upgrade only for a little pocket change of $425,000. It is very hard to justify that expenditure on a aircraft that lost 8 million in value in 2008 and has not come back.

So be thankful that we have folks who are willing to stand behind the Classic
Skyview. I am.

My 02c

Jack Hunt
 

Garrett

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I agree, after years of dealing with Garmin, Bendix King/Honeywell and their proprietary equipment Dynon is like a breathe of fresh air. At least we get a say so with Dynon.
 

Dynon

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To clarify - yes, the next software updates have a number of improvements to both SkyView-side software and the SV-ADSB-472 firmware, and this will make major improvements. That is coming out shortly. As we've previously mentioned, we're working on the hardware performance side of things with uAvionix as well.
 

krw5927

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Can you confirm whether the next software update will include industry-standard format ADSB reception over serial (e.g., GDL90)?
 

Raymo

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Can you confirm whether the next software update will include industry-standard format ADSB reception over serial (e.g., GDL90)?

This has been suggested in other threads but no one has actually put it in the Suggestion forum, where it belongs, and Dynon has not yet mentioned its inclusion in a future release. Not that they tell us everything that is coming.
 

Dynon

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This next release is focused on improving the SV-ADSB-472 performance. It does not have additional device support.
 

Dynon101

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I could not tell from a cursory read of this post but when is the 472 going to be shipping again?
 

Dynon

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We don't have a ship date to announce yet, but it's the number one engineering priority here.
 

acepilot59

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What is the status of the ADS-B 472?
I was originally told that they would be shipping in October then after the first of the year and now its almost March.
 

CGameProgrammer

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I still have the 470. Does the new software improve it as well or are the fixes only applicable to the 472?
 

dlloyd

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I have been told in the last week or so that there will be no change to the 470 other than increasing the "coast time" by several seconds, the time traffic is displayed even though no traffic is received.
I have had an ongoing problem with my 470 receiving TIS-OK even though there are many ADSB stations in range. Anyone else?
 

krw5927

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I have been told in the last week or so that there will be no change to the 470 other than increasing the "coast time" by several seconds, the time traffic is displayed even though no traffic is received.
I have had an ongoing problem with my 470 receiving TIS-OK even though there are many ADSB stations in range.  Anyone else?

Yes, I have this problem with my 470 box quite often.  This and the fact that it's been many, many months since the problem with the 472 was discovered and we still have no solution, are reasons why I'm ditching Dynon's ADSB-in devices all together.  A much cheaper Stratux has proven to work better and more reliably.  Now if only Dynon would receive GDL90 format like everyone else does...
 

Raymo

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I have been told in the last week or so that there will be no change to the 470 other than increasing the "coast time" by several seconds, the time traffic is displayed even though no traffic is received.
I have had an ongoing problem with my 470 receiving TIS-OK even though there are many ADSB stations in range.  Anyone else?

As another data point, mine has been working flawlessly for the past 13 months since my first flight. Many factors seem to come into play for IN performance, such as antenna placement (also relative to other antennas), ground plane, surrounding transmitters (e.g. cell towers), etc.

An exception was yesterday when flying over my hope field. I did a tight, 270 degree turn once airborne and I received a traffic warning at my altitude, which turned out to be me. It went away after a few puckering seconds :D
 
A

alexe

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Dynon has gone silent again on the progress of the fix for the -472 on this forum. My recent email question regarding the same to support has gone unanswered. This is not the way to treat customers. PLEASE, HOW ABOUT SOME COMMUNICATION! (Even if its not positive, just keep us informed).
 

swatson999

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They just posted on Feb. 8 that they didn't have a ship date yet, but it's their number 1 priority engineering item.

How did we *ever* fly using just our eyeballs to find traffic?
 
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